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ESL forum >
Grammar and Linguistics > Just curious about English grammar!
Just curious about English grammar!
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Olindalima ( F )
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Welcome, Logos, that is the way I like, this should not be the dead�s poets� club; to study dead languages we can study latin, languages are very serious and "free" so, sometimes it is really difficult to explain what we mean, mainly in a foreigner lang.
ANYWAY; and if you don�t mind, I would like to go back to "my broken leg". I am sure you understand, I don�t want to go on with this silly leg this way - broken.
Explain me, please:
If I say " I have broken my leg since I was 12 " it seems to me that I broke my leg and it never, never ever got well. I mean, the action has never stopped since that time, so I have had my leg broken for years and years.
If i say " I break my leg ( some now and then, I usually have this problem ) since I was 12", for me, this means I frequently break it, but then, ( God is good ) my leg becomes well, so that I can break it again. ( hehehe)
The action stops and later it goes on, to stop again and ... this is the frequency I was speaking about.
Any comments, please?????
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21 Oct 2008
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paujo
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Hi ,
I am a native speaker as well (Canadian) and with respect to the first sentence ... I smoke since... I have to agree with Kevin. Though it is not proper English grammar and it�s never correct , it�s out there. It can be heard as spoken English in songs and movies along with other words which are grammatically incorrect. I think it�s very important that we teach proper grammar and make a point of also explaining to students that like in any language there are words and expressions which are sometimes used in everyday conversation that are not proper grammar words. Students usually understand this, accept it and move right along.
A note to Olidalima, with respect to your last questions
"""If I say " I have broken my leg since I was 12 " it seems to me that I broke my leg and it never, never ever got well. I mean, the action has never stopped since that time, so I have had my leg broken for years and years.f I say " I have broken my leg since I was 12 "
I have broken my leg since I was 12 ... only means you keep breaking it. I think it may seem like it has never healed to you because of the similarity to your language, I think that may be the confusion because in spanish it is acceptable to say " Fumo desde los 12 a�os" I may be wrong , just an idea.
It�s great to see all the input from around the world.
keep it up guys!!
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21 Oct 2008
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Logos
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The sentence "I have broken my leg since I was 12" cannot be correct in English. The present perfect tense speaks about events which happened at an indefinite time in the past, or events which have a direct influence upon �now�. The breaking of a leg is not usually a long protracted event, a broken leg is fairly instantaneous and so if you are now 30 years old, then it has taken a long time to break!!!
The correct sentence would be "I have had a broken leg since I was 12." This would indicate that the break occurred when you were 12, but the injury has permanently affected your walking or gait and so the result of the break can still be observed today. |
21 Oct 2008
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paujo
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Yes Logos, I totally agree!! |
21 Oct 2008
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Mietz
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Could I say "I�ve kept breaking my leg since I was 12?"
Thanks for this interesting discussion! :-)
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21 Oct 2008
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goodnesses
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Hi , Vickiii
Sorry I did read all what the colleagues said about it in their post but as a teacher in the class I would accept when of my kids saying "I smoke since I was 12" it is grammatically incorrect.
However, as far as today�s teens "language courant" I would accept it.
If I have to do this as a listening I would certainly warn my kids about it. But I can expect them do the remrk by themselves.
Remember what I said some days ago, "I �ve" already heard a british one say "Check this out. Today we is gonna be chatting..."
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21 Oct 2008
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Ayaniw
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Hi everybody,
I don�t think it is a matter of accepting or refusing an incorrect sentence. It�s just that are some rules that should be followed when dealing with grammar correctness.
Dear French frog, I�m sure the sentence given by your pupil is just the translation from French:
"Je fume depuis que j�avais 12 ans."
I smoke since I was 12. This sentence is grammatically wrong. We are teaching our kids standard English not street English.
The main clause (I smoke) should be in the PRESENT PERFECT and the time clause in the SIMPLE PAST. (If it is not a clause , then we should have a date in the past.
Finally SINCE can be used with the SIMPLE PRESENT only in the following case:
It is six months since I saw him. = I haven�t seen him for six months.
But here we�re talking of the use of IT in expressions of time not since.
Thank you all for your contributions.
P.S. I would never accept the following sentences:
"I break my leg since I was 16."
"I have broken my leg since I was 16."
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22 Oct 2008
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goodnesses
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Ooops, sorry
"but as a teacher in the class I would never accept one of my kids saying "I smoke since I was 12" it is grammatically incorrect"
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22 Oct 2008
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