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Ask for help > vocabulary help needed
vocabulary help needed
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Mietz
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Interesting discussion. :-)
I just checked "Hastrman(n)" and didn �t find much on it �s origin but that it apparently translates to "horse man" which does indeed sound a bit similar.
I also found an Austrian tale about it. Maybe there �s the connection? And there was also some hint about the Slavic background. So loads to chose from. ;-)
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18 Aug 2010
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Mietz
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Thanks for the link moravc! Very interesting. I �m wondering, what "Hastr" could actually come from in German. I just can �t quite get the connection to the water (Wasser) yet, but it �s nice to learn more. :-)
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18 Aug 2010
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mish.cz
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@ Sulekra: Yeaaa, Northern Moravia is yet better than Northern Bohemia� @ Mietz: Is the word "hastrman" really translated like "horseman"? Wow, that would 1) contradict to what it really stands for in Czech 2) support the "kelpy" word we were discussing at the beginning. Gosh, it �s so interesting!!!!!!!! @Moravc: Thank you so much for your diligence while looking for and providing with the best resources to explain it! Thank you, you busy bee:-)))
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18 Aug 2010
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Mietz
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Well - I �m not sure about the horse man. I �ve never heard the Word "Hastrman" before. But I found this Google link. Yes - exciting, that there the "Kelpy" comes in again... :-)
There are loads of other links about the waterman connection. I just read the Germanic word "wazzrman" somewhere. That makes it somehow possible for my phantasy, that this could be made into "hastr".
Funnily enough I also found this link and "hastr" also seems to be a Swiss or Austrian or Bavarian version of "have" (haben).
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18 Aug 2010
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moravc
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@ Mietz:
As far as I know Czech "hastrman" or "vastrman" comes from German "Wassermann", I suppose the old Czechs heard the German fairy tales and took the word from the German language but they changed the pronunciation and the spelling a bit....
So "hastr-" is wrongly pronouced German word "Wasser-" (water in English)
Hastrman in Czech is the very same creature as Wasserman in German
The TRUE Slavic (Czech and Slovakian) word would be VODNIK.
The Vodyanoy has different appearance and what�s more it has a fish�s TAIL! - naked old man with a greenish beard and long hair, with his
body covered in algae and muck, usually covered in black fish scales.
He has webbed paws instead of hands, a fish�s tail, eyes that burn like
red-hot coals.
I am afraid there is no precise ENGLISH name for Vodnik... so we can use universal expressions such as a water goblin or a water-man or a water creature...
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18 Aug 2010
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Mietz
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@ moravc: You are very likely correct. I just enjoyed the quest. :-)
Is there actually a Czech word "hastr" which could be translated, or is it part of the name?
Anyway - am off now. Will check tomorrow. Thanks for the fun. :-)
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18 Aug 2010
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mish.cz
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I think that there doesn �t necessarily have to be an original German word similar to "Hastr" that would be a basis for "Hastrman". Or, better, there is, but it again is "Wasser". I found that in old Czech it was spelt "vastrman" and there the connection is obvious.�
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18 Aug 2010
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moravc
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@ Mietz
Mish is right.
Hastr- is a wrongly pronounced part of the German word Wasser-.
So hastrman means Wassermann.
There are another old-fashioned Czech spellings of the word "hastrman": vasrman, vastrman, basrman...
"Hastr-" is just first part of the word hastrman... no specific meaning in Czech....
BTW if you say about a boy "He was like a hastrman" it means he was not properly dressed, he was wearing old, ugly or dirty clothes or even rugs... :-(
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18 Aug 2010
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Lina Ladybird
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Reading more and more about this "Wassermann" issue, all your posts - but especially moravc �s post in which she mentioned "he has webbed paws instead of hands" - suddenly reminded me of the German author Otfried Preu�ler, who wrote a few books about "The Little Water-sprite" in the 1950s. I remember that I read all of them when I was about 9 years old...
Mish, maybe using an extract of one of these lovely and well-written books might be a suitable way to let your ss know about this cute "water goblin"?? Here �s a picture of him:
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19 Aug 2010
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