|
ESL Forum:
Techniques and methods
in Language Teaching
Games, activities
and teaching ideas
Grammar and
Linguistics
Teaching material
Concerning
worksheets
Concerning
powerpoints
Concerning online
exercises
Make suggestions,
report errors
Ask for help
Message board
|
ESL forum >
Ask for help > Why shall?
Why shall?
|
sashulochka
|
Why shall?
|
|
There is one famous phrase from the Lord of the Rings movies. "You shall not pass" Could you explain why we use shall? Thanks for your answers.
|
22 May 2014
|
|
|
|
yanogator
|
|
It �s from an old grammar rule. In the past, the future was formed by "shall" in the first person, and "will" in the second or third person. I shall be there tomorrow. I hope you will be there, too. However, in the imperative, they are switched. I will take my turn! You shall do your homework now! So, "You shall not pass" is the negative imperative, second person. By the way, the last time I saw that usage in school was in 1966. Bruce |
22 May 2014
|
|
|
paugyg
|
Well, maybe I am completely wrong here, but I remember something specific my History teacher said in one of my classes at University, we were analyzing a speech from a president (I don �t remember the speech nor the president) and there was a line with "shall", so she drew a comparison with Gandalf �s famous line "You shall not pass" (of course, this is the part that I remember about the lesson  ). She explained that the use of "shall" in both cases was not merely to refer to the future because "shall" has a very important connotation: a sense of will on the part of the speaker. That is to say, when I say: "You shall not pass", I �m not only saying that in the future you will not pass, but I �m also implying MY involvement and commitment in your not passing. I mean: I will make sure you won �t pass.I might have made things more confusing  Maybe there �s someone out there who can explain this formally, sorry for the mess I made with my explanation! |
22 May 2014
|
|
|
papadeli
|
|
When you want to express a strong determination, shall is used with you, he, she, it, they.
You shall not go to the cinema!
Greetings from Greece,
papadeligames.wordpress.com |
22 May 2014
|
|
|
edrodmedina
|
|
@paugyg- The is following is from Lincoln �s Gettysburg address..... It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us�that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion�that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain�that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom�and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth. |
22 May 2014
|
|
|
paugyg
|
@paugyg- The is following is from Lincoln �s Gettysburg address..... It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us�that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion�that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain�that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom�and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth. --- Yes, that is it! That was the speech we were analyzing in my History class! Shame on me, that speech is as memorable as Gandalf �s famous line, to say the least! Frankly, I �m quite embarrased. My History teacher would definitely be ashamed of me if she ever found out I remembered the Gandalf reference instead of Lincoln �s Gettysburg address...  |
|
22 May 2014
|
|
|
ueslteacher
|
|
It �s like in the ten commandments, "Thou shall not kill" |
22 May 2014
|
|
|
yanogator
|
|
Actually, it �s "Thou shalt not kill". If you are going to use the "King James" pronoun, you must use the verb form that goes with it. Bruce |
24 May 2014
|
|
|
