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ESL forum >
Message board > Cancelled account
Cancelled account
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Yulia Mo
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@cheezels. We are not talking about the case a year ago. We are talking about now, when Mar was aware of what �s happening, but instead of fixing her wss she accused those reporting her of jealousy of some kind. She had plenty of time to reupload or delete the copied wss, but she chose not to, because she knew this was gonna happen. The question is - does she care?
It �s really really sad what �s happening here today. I hope we are all gonna fix it with Victor �s help and move on. I don �t believe we should quit (though i �m also gonna refrain myself from the reported page for now as i don �t see any sense in it). Like any community, any family, ours have its ups and downs and turn your back and say i quit is childish, IMHO.
Let �s wait what Victor has to say and see how we can fix it. I believe in this community. I love it.
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15 Feb 2010
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manonski (f)
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Cheezels, I don �t cheer when someone �s accounts gets deleted. My questions are not about Mar but about members in general. Let �s call her Manonski if you want instead of Mar. It does not matter which name you put on the situation. It �s not about a person... it �s about being fair. Like I said earlier, if I am proven guilty of being a cheater 3 times and my account gets cancelled... so be it. I don �t want to be treated differently. Rules are there for a reason.
As for what happened a year ago, Mar did post a thread explaining her conversation with Victor. It �s there, just look it up.
I do respect Victor. He has my admiration for creating this site and putting up with all of us. |
15 Feb 2010
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pollyanna_pl
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Hi everyone,
Although I am very new to the site and have only just collected mote that 1000 points, I would like to share some of my thoughts about this perpetually ongoing discussion, hoping it will give you a picture of what a well-intentioned newbie to this site may be experiencing.
1. Yesterday, I came across a collection of photgraphs in picasa. I would definitely have used it for a ws if I hadn �t come across an old ws by zailda just the precious day. I would have ended up with a different exercise, that much is for sure, but the pictures would have been identical. Can anyone assure me that if I had used those pictures I wouldn �t have been pointed out as a thief by a well-meaning member of the site? I think not.
From what I read in this thread, I realise that more experienced members than myself are experiencing the same kind of doubts as I am.
So I think that it would be helpful to re-establish what is or isn �t stolen work.
2. Secondly, I think that automatic procedures are fine, but justice can never be adequately done in this way. Just stating my personal view and hoping this doesn �t sound too arrogant, I would like to have the chance to answer for myself if a ws of mine was found "guilty" and be given the chance to erase it myself if by accident I had used material that had been previously used by someone else.
BUT: as long as things are as they are, yes, I would like justice to be for everyone and everyone should have the same treatment. And just let me play devil �s advocate for a moment:
if an old member should be forgiven for breaking the rules despite having the knowledge and the experience to avoid it,
why should the X newcomer to site be punished with a ban when perhaps their only fault was that they were not fully aware of how things are done and what might or might not constitute plagiarism or theft ?
To be frank, with the reality of the internet surrounding us, I wouldn �t feel comfortable shouting out �Thief! � to anyone unless the ws is an exact copy of another person �s work.
3. To my (inexperienced, I must repeat) eyes, both sides of this argument seem equally right - or wrong (!). But this perhaps means that there is something wrong with the procedures rather than with the people.
Victor, maybe you could help this wonderful, thriving site by making things clearer for everyone. When the site consisted of a bunch of friends, who respected each other and themselves, maybe rules were less important, but now things are no longer the same.
Although I would never vote for or against banning Mar (whose work I am not familiar with and who I didn �t even know as a name), I still believe that justice should be blind, and I think that most people would agree to this principle. So, if both decisions seem unfair, maybe is a legal gap that �s causing the problem.
I truly trust that the creator(s) of the site will manage to rise above the challenge posed by the very success of their creation.
Have a nice Sunday.
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15 Feb 2010
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MJ_Misa
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It just came to my mind what would the authors of the book say if they knew someone has copied and uploaded something totally copied from their book and it looks it �s OK. They would have to laugh if the first thing they �d see after coming to this site is a campaign against cheaters, yet they were cheated and nothing happened. 
BTW: I saw sooooooooooooooooooo many copied and non-ESL contributions today and no-one cares and reports them. I wonder why?
@cheezels: I don �t understand why you are getting so mad. Last year there was 1 ws questioned (as I understood from the thread which link you kindly provided). But know there were 13 wss proved as copies. Well, after today we, at least, can be sure there ARE members better than others and there ARE different rules for elite.
Have a nice day, M.
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15 Feb 2010
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zailda
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Michaela, no one reports them because it �s pointless. Why should they be penalized? Because most of them are newbies trying to get points to download? Because the rules apply to them?
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15 Feb 2010
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silvia.patti
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When two days ago I saw Mar �s many wss were reported as copied from books, I was very surprised because some time ago I downloaded some of her contributions and they seemed to me very useful. I thought she knew the rules very well, being an old member.
Now I think that if she was wrong, as a new member could be, she must pay fo her mistake. She was angry to read our comments about her copied contributions and wrote we were jealous... I think, as most of you, she should have edited her contributions; it �s quite difficult to re-upload a ws in 24 hours (some days I have no time to work at mine!!!), but she could have asked a week to re-do her work. I think we should have appreciate her request and have let her the necessary time...
I have nothing against Mar, I think in the same way for all the members here. The rule is: 3 strikes and you are out. Was it Victor �s guilty to let her upload her mother �s wss? OK!!! Restore her account without the copied wss. But if she continues to upload this kind of wss, she is out forever.
When I decide to report a ws, I take my time to decide if it �s right or wrong to do it. It �s quite difficult for me to judge if a ws is scanned (there are a lot of them) or not, if it is copied from web/other members � wss or not.
I have sometimes PMed a member, asking to modify his/her ws, but as nothing happened, I have decided that since now I only report them when they don �t follow the rules. It � s sad but it �s so.
This is my POV, it �s very difficult to follow the rules, but we are teachers, we ask our students to follow rules and we have to be the first to do it.
Hugs, Silvia
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15 Feb 2010
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Zora
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I am going to say something very simple here:
This is Victor �s site. Period. No questions asked. If you don �t like what he does then either you leave or you learn to put up with his decisions. It is that simple really.
Victor is a fair man and I see no reason not to accept his decision. He thought it prudent and that HIS prerogative. It is not ours to say. We are here as guests. We can leave at any time we want. He has only given us a place to share work and I admire him for that and I do not publicly say that he is wrong like many here have - because guess what? He is not wrong because it �s HIS site, not ours.
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15 Feb 2010
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JulietaVL
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Victor �s site
Victor �s site
Victor �s site
Well said Zora, if I do not like it, I leave it... who am I to question him? who am I? a simple member, no more important than others, if I report stuff, I try to keep the site clean, help members in the forum etc... good for me. That does not give me the right to go and tell the owner how to behave.
@Cheezels: those who do not understand why you are so mad should remember when they were mad too and quit the site in the past...
I hope you do not leave the site because of a bunch of people, there are more important things...
Deaf ears to some people from now on... |
15 Feb 2010
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zailda
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We are completely aware this is Victor �s site. We didn �t say the contrary. We also thank him for this site. We dedicated much time and effort to it to show our admiration and respect. The question is not who the site owner is. The question are the rules. Will we have clear rules that apply equaly to everyone?
We know we are free to leave, no need to bother to show us the exit. We know where it is.
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15 Feb 2010
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Yulia Mo
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You are right, dear Zora. It �s Victor �s site and i admire him for what he �s doing to make it live. But it �s also a community where we all have the right to express our opinion, don �t we?
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15 Feb 2010
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